Greece just wiped out US stock maket

[ralph]

Thanks Greg , and well , just found this because it is my thinking that England is part of the Euro'peon' union because it is part of the 'united kingdom' . Yep , I know about the SWISS and I agree with the Swiss . Many English also dislike being part of the euro union ! ! Lots of eastern europeon third worlders traveling into England to take jobs same as the third worlders come to the USA to steal jobs . Off topic but its the same way with the USA , Canada and mexico which due to shenanigans of 'american' politicians like the 'boosh' we are headed to an ' north americun union ' .

[GFB]

Yes, England is part of the European Union.

They are not part of the Euro Zone..they still have their own currency.

[ralph]

and a Union between Canada and the USA doesn't really bother me . I used to go to Canada every once in awhile , been doing that land since the early 50s with my parents . Toured Canada for a couple weeks on my motorcycle in the late 60s . Traveled though again a few times in the 70s , very early 80s with wife and kids . Thing is that Canada might as well be the USA . Course I won't say that to a Canadian that I want to be friendly with . Course , what I say about Canada doesn't include 'quebec' or 'mexico ' !!

[GFB]

It gets even MORE confusing when you start talking "United Kingdom."

Ireland is part of the United Kingdom..and is part of the Euro Zone.

England is part of the United Kingdom..and is NOT part of the Euro Zone.

Both are part of the E.U.

Confused yet?

[ralph]

thanks Greg , euro zone , euro union are the same to me because the English have lost sovereignty and as I said , they have to put up with 'eastern' euros looking for jobs and crossing borders with impunity if I understand correctly . Swiss are smart to never get involved and even they have immigration problems I think .

[ralph]

Well , thanks for the informative conversation , this what GOOD message boards are supposed to be about in my opinion !!

[GFB]

thanks Greg , euro zone , euro union are the same to me because the English have lost sovereignty..

Just remember' please, they are not the same..they are two completely different things.

Switzerland is in the Eurpean union..not part of the euro countries.

[GFB]

Markets are already reacting to Greece's rejection of Europe's latest bailout offer, and it's not pretty to watch.
The euro fell sharply after early results of a referendum Sunday showed Greek voters said "no" to the offer, backing their left-wing prime minister's call to reject austerity.

The currency dropped by more than 1% against the U.S. dollar to trade at around $1.10.
The vote could trigger a series of events that leads to Greece becoming the first country to leave the euro.
Here's why: Greece is on the brink of going bust. It urgently needs money to pay pensions and wages, and to reopen its banks -- shut for a week already after talks with its creditors collapsed.
If Europe isn't prepared to relax the terms it was offering Greece just last weekend, and there's no indication it will, Greece will have to start printing its own currency soon.
The risk of fallout from Greece's collapse directly hurting other European countries is relatively small. Most of its debt is held by governments who could cope with default.
But it will take the eurozone -- the bloc of 19 nations that use the euro -- into uncharted waters.
It also sets a bad precedent. Membership in the euro was supposed to be a one-way street. In fact, there's no rule book to manage a member country going bust and crashing out.
It's hard to imagine any other country choosing to follow Greece into the economic abyss, but some weaker eurozone economies may pay the price in permanently higher borrowing costs if a 'Grexit' materializes.
The uncertainty of the next few months could also weigh on European business confidence at a tricky time. The eurozone economy (except Greece) is recovering nicely, but investors are worried about the impact a slowdown in China will have on exports.
Central banks have been preparing for the worst. The European Central Bank unveiled a significant new weapon in its armory last week, when it said it may buy the bonds of a number of companies in vulnerable eurozone countries such as Italy, Portugal and Spain as part of its massive stimulus program.

[GFB]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CJLyyozWcAQ3QxA.jpg

[planosteve]

The solution is to print a new currency with a picture of a real good looking politician on it. That wows them every time. I recommend Socrates.

[planosteve]

The solution is to print a new currency with a picture of a really ugly but respected politician on it. That wows them every time. I recommend Socrates.
Or on 2nd thought maybe a well know actor. How about John Travolta?

[Kiamichi]

This seems to have been the most important election the country has ever had, and according to the news only 60% of the electorate even bothered to vote.

[planosteve]

This seems to have been the most important election the country has ever had, and according to the news only 60% of the electorate even bothered to vote.

I think that is more than the last presidential election where only 55% of the voting age Americans bothered to vote.

[ralph]

and I think , read somewhere that tourism deals oughta be pretty good in Greece plus maybe take some bars of chocolate for the girls .

[ralph]

and Greg , was just reading and JiP brought up taxation some where in this thread . I was reading and read that the biggest reason that Greece has such a low rate of collecting taxes is because there are huge numbers of self employed amongst Greeces society . Being self employed in Greece gives a large measure of freedom from taxation because no one knows how much money a person actually makes except for the person making the money . ---------- Just read it , makes sense to me !!

[GFB]

Yes..they're a "cash is king" country.

That part I like, and I like the low rate of tax collecting.

They just would have had to have a "no free stuff" policy to go with it.

[John in Plano]

and Greg , was just reading and JiP brought up taxation some where in this thread . I was reading and read that the biggest reason that Greece has such a low rate of collecting taxes is because there are huge numbers of self employed amongst Greeces society . Being self employed in Greece gives a large measure of freedom from taxation because no one knows how much money a person actually makes except for the person making the money . ---------- Just read it , makes sense to me !!

blue collar and white collar are tax cheats

Here is a section from the 2012 University of Chicago paper:

On average, self-employed Greeks spend 82% of their monthly reported income servicing debt. To put this number in perspective, the standard practice in consumer finance (in the United States as well as Greece) is to never lend to borrowers such that loan payments are greater than 30% of monthly income. And that is the upper limit ...

A number of banks in southern Europe told us point blank that they have adaptation formulas to adjust clients' reported income to the bank's best estimate of true income, and furthermore, that these adjustments are specific to occupations ... Take the examples of lawyers, doctors, financial services, and accountants. In all of these occupations, the self-employed are paying over 100% of their reported income flows to debt servicing on consumer loans

You read that right: More than 100% of the self-reported income of Greece's professional classes is going toward paying off consumer debts. Not, we suspect, because they have massive unbearable repayments to make, but because they're colossally underreporting their income.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/this-is- ... z3f7eHOa9N

[planosteve]

Only when money is fiat is that a problem like the Greece mess possible. That is why the founders dictated that money could only be gold or silver. It automaticly prevents loaning too much money. Something that I've heard nobody mention.

[John in Plano]

Only when money is fiat is that a problem like the Greece mess possible. That is why the founders dictated that money could only be gold or silver. It automaticly prevents loaning too much money. Something that I've heard nobody mention.

That doesn't prevent tax cheats or banks that play with numbers.

I thought the big secret of Fort Knox is the gold is gone or was it some bank that loaned all there customers gold to another entity ?

[ralph]

and just listening to a guy on radio , he makes the point that austerity is coming to the Greeks no matter this latest vote . That being the case , why not stiff the euro bankers and be independent as possible while you suffer ?? That makes sense to me , he11 , the Greek people that just voted didn't agree to these agreements with the euro bankers .