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The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 7:55 am
by Ric
which group was worse? These were my weekend reflections after Mass yesterday.
At Mass this morning, Fr Mel spoke about a Franciscan martyr, St Maximilian Kobe.. a man of Polish descent who lived for many years in Russia. It was a fascinating story, and I wish I had been able to talk to him after Mass with some questions, but he was preparing for the next Mass, so I left. But, I will.
Like most Franciscans, he was a gentle and kind man, had tuberculosis, and was very frail most of his adult life. He started the Militia of the Immaculate, which was a publication, and it became the motivation for the formation of the group Knights Of Immaculate, devoted to our Spiritual Mother.
Famous for his compassion, he was arrested with hundreds of others and ended up in the famous POW encampment, Auschwitz. There for but a short time, there was a prisoner escape. He was caught, and as a punishment/warning to others, 10 prisoners were chosen to die by starvation. One of these men cried out for his family, and Maximilian offered to die in this man's stead. He lived too long, and the Nazi's finally gave him a lethal injection of carbolic acid.
Throughout his captivity, and during those final days, he preached forgiveness to the POW's.. Love your enemies and Pray for your persecutors.. a noble, yet meek martyr.
I also learned while looking at materials after Mass, that millions of Catholics died alongside Millions of Jews in these death camps..
My question to Father was going to be simple. If he were alive today, would he preach the same forgiveness for today's Terrorists? I can't remember being asked to forgive any act taken by radical Muslim Terrorists, yet, the correlation is almost certainly the same. The Nazis were that era's terrorists, and though we didn't know it at the time, far more people were killed by the Nazis. Maximilian knew, though, and still asked those, even knowing they were going to die.. to forgive and pray for the aggressors.
Pretty good article, here:http://www.ewtn.com/library/MARY/whostmax.htm
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 8:18 am
by planosteve
millions of Catholics died alongside Millions of Jews in these death camps.
I don't believe this is true according to the historic records.
According to Wikipedia "At least 1.1 million prisoners died at Auschwitz, around 90 percent of them Jewish; approximately 1 in 6 Jews killed in the Holocaust died at the camp."
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 8:28 am
by Ric
The article may have been incorrect, But millions of others DID get destroyed in Nazi Death Camps. And it really wasn't my biggest point in the whole thing, but thanks for taking it and pointing that out
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_victims
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 8:43 am
by Sangersteve
I think the big take away is that the nazi's were not on a religious campaign, their goal was world domination through racial cleansing. As a group the nazi was recognizable as evil via the leaders,the average German was as oppressed as the Jews, most following orders to avoid being destroyed by their own. A case,I believe can be made that the call to forgive German terrorist's was not for the nazi party, but for the soldier's.
The muslims are bent an world domination because of their religion and will kill even children and other muslims to justify their cause. Since you can not pick a muslim terrorist out of a crowd, no one except other muslim terrorists and the supporters,can find a reason to forgive the sins of terror.
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 8:45 am
by GFB
planosteve wrote:millions of Catholics died alongside Millions of Jews in these death camps.
I don't believe this is true according to the historic records.
According to Wikipedia "At least 1.1 million prisoners died at Auschwitz, around 90 percent of them Jewish; approximately 1 in 6 Jews killed in the Holocaust died at the camp."
Besides the 6 million Jews, the Nazis slaughtered 2 million Catholics as well.
Whether some were in the same death camps as the Jews, that I don't know.
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 9:03 am
by Sangersteve
How can anyone except a muslim terrorist defend this or ask for the rapist to be forgiven?
According to a security source in Diyala province, the terrorist organization ISIS beheaded a 30 year old woman for killing one its members as he attempted to rape her in her home located northeast of Baquba.
The source said in an interview for IraqiNews.com: “On Wednesday, a member of the terrorist organization ISIS attempted to rape a 30 year old woman inside her house in a village located in the northern district of Muqdadiya (35 km northeast of Baquba), but she managed to grab his gun and kill him in order to maintain her honor. The woman was resting at home and recovering from a medical illness before the attack occurred.”
The source, who requested anonymity, added that “members of ISIS imposed a perimeter in the vicinity of the incident before arresting the sick woman and then killing her by cutting off her head with a sword as per the sentence issued by the Sharia Court of the organization.”
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 9:15 am
by planosteve
GFB wrote:planosteve wrote:millions of Catholics died alongside Millions of Jews in these death camps.
I don't believe this is true according to the historic records.
According to Wikipedia "At least 1.1 million prisoners died at Auschwitz, around 90 percent of them Jewish; approximately 1 in 6 Jews killed in the Holocaust died at the camp."
Besides the 6 million Jews, the Nazis slaughtered 2 million Catholics as well.
Whether some were in the same death camps as the Jews, that I don't know.
Where do you findinformation that the Nazis killed 2 million Catholics?
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 9:20 am
by Ric
But they WERE on a rampage against Christianity.. and he was particularly scared of and bent on destroying not only Catholics but all Christians. He incorporated the entire Protestant faith and absorbed it into the Nazi teachings. Hitler wanted people to worship him and not Christ. No doubt he wanted racial cleansing, but he also put high value on destruction of the Roman Catholics. Many many thousands of Catholic men, women, children and priests were murdered during this particular time..
http://www.catholic.com/magazine/articl ... -holocaust
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 9:23 am
by Ric
Most Catholic publications put the number at over two million.
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 9:30 am
by planosteve
Ric wrote:Most Catholic publications put the number at over two million.
Not exactly an impartial historical record.
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 10:05 am
by truep
I don't call one of the other the "worst". they are both evil and deserve to be wiped out!
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 10:31 am
by Ric
planosteve wrote:Ric wrote:Most Catholic publications put the number at over two million.
Not exactly an impartial historical record.
Neither is your assessment that it's not
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 10:33 am
by Sangersteve
Of the 11 million people killed during the Holocaust, six million were Polish citizens. Three million were Polish Jews and another three million were Polish Christians. Most of the remaining victims were from other countries including Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Ukraine, Russia, Holland, France and even Germany.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jso ... ctims.html
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 12:03 pm
by RaisinCain
truep wrote:I don't call one of the other the "worst". they are both evil and deserve to be wiped out!
+1; arguing which is the worst may be constructive in some ways, but it's like who's worse, Charles Manson or Richard Speck. Both need extermination.
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 2:44 pm
by Dancer
RaisinCain wrote:truep wrote:I don't call one of the other the "worst". they are both evil and deserve to be wiped out!
+1; arguing which is the worst may be constructive in some ways, but it's like who's worse, Charles Manson or Richard Speck. Both need extermination.
+2 RaisinCain.
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 2:46 pm
by BigTex
Manson is worse because he is still alive.
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 4:13 pm
by Red Oak
The Nazis, that lived and were de-Nazified made great contributions to our World; that the Jihadists are not capable of.
The Nazis also got their eugenic ideas from America, in large part.
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 4:30 pm
by BillB
I think they are the same level of evil.
The NAZIs killed for their ideology the Muslims kill for theirs.
We aren't in a position to forgive either one of them unless we have personally been wronged by them.
When and if we are, we'll each have to make that decision.
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 4:55 pm
by GFB
They are more equal then anyone realizes.
The Nazis were Fascists who were deeply anti Semitic.
That is pretty much the definition of a Nazi.
The Muslims are both as well..Fascists as well as deeply Semitic.
That is why I believe Michael Medved has coined the best name for them.."Islamo Nazis."
Re: The Nazis vs Radical Muslim Terrorists
Posted: Mon Oct 27, 2014 4:58 pm
by Red Oak
The difference is that some Nazis had something to fall back on when they were defeated, the Jihadists have no redeeming value.
The Nazi were quite fond of the Goose Steppers and vice versa.